Thursday 24 July 2025

Topics: Parliament resuming, Greens stunts, Gaza protests, anti-semitism

E&OE.......................

STEPHEN CENATIEMPO: Alright, first week of Parliament is wrapping up today. To talk to us about that and a bunch of other things is the Shadow Assistant Minister for Competition, Charities and Treasury, and former Ambassador to Israel, Senator Dave Sharma. Dave, good morning.

DAVE SHARMA: Good morning, Stephen. Great to join you.

STEPHEN CENATIEMPO: First week in Parliament, I mentioned to Kieran Gilbert earlier this morning that, um, you know, it was more circus like than I remember any opening to Parliament. Uh, there seemed to be everything going on.

DAVE SHARMA: Well, look, there were a few stunts performed unfortunately, by the Greens, which, you know, I think detracted from the dignity and decorum and, you know, the proper role of Parliament. That was a distraction. There was a lot of ceremony as well, of course, in the Governor General's opening address, the last post at the war memorial a large number of new members being sworn in, first speeches. So we are only really getting down to serious business. You know, yesterday and today.

STEPHEN CENATIEMPO: We saw Mehreen Faruqi holding up a sign in the Senate which is, you know, is anathema to Senate rules. She was censured. But the reality is it means nothing. I mean, you guys are lucky in the Senate that you can do almost anything you like. And you sort of, you sit there for six years now we've got some serious people like you, but then we've got some people that are just completely there for activist purposes.

DAVE SHARMA: Look, I find that not only disappointing, but distasteful. It's an immense privilege to have a position in Parliament and it gives you immense opportunities to speak out on all number of issues. And there's all sorts of forums in the Parliament. There's private members, bills, there's senator’s statements, there's access to the media. So no one's saying Mehreen Faruqi or anyone else can't have a voice. But it's about the proper forum and respecting the standing orders and rules so that everyone gets to have a voice and everyone gets to have a voice equally. And if we descend into this sort of anarchy or chaos where, you know, anyone can hold up a sign and anyone can disrupt the proceedings of Parliament or hijack what's meant to be being discussed for their own purposes, you know, Parliament will cease to function. So for me this is about the rules and norms of the institution and making sure that every senator and parliamentarian, and as a result every Australian has a voice in our nation's, you know, deliberative body.

STEPHEN CENATIEMPO: Now, I want to talk sort of related to Mehreen Faruqi is these pro Palestine protests that have been happening here in Canberra and the narrative around them. And I made this point to Chris Kenny on his program on Tuesday night, and I know you appear on Chris's program quite often as well, that the information that people are relying on to demonise Israel and the Israeli Defence Force is largely coming from a terrorist organisation. How is it that our media can't seem to distinguish that they're getting information sources from, you know, it might be the Palestinian Health Organisation or whatever, which is run by Hamas.

DAVE SHARMA: Yeah, look, I think that's a real problem. I mean, the main sources of information from Gaza are Hamas and, you know, pro Palestinian information ministries, and they've been exposed now time and time again as, you know, basically putting out false narratives or false information or false figures. So you need to treat it with a grain of scepticism. And I just make the point. I mean, you know, I think we all want an end to the fighting in Gaza. There is a ceasefire proposal on the table which the US and Egypt and Qatar have helped formulate, which I understand Israel has agreed to, which would end the fighting, which would allow more humanitarian aid to return, which would importantly return at least some of the hostages. And it's Hamas that's steadfastly refusing to agree to that. So rather than protesting about the Australian government, which can do very little about this, people should be directing their ire, I think, at Hamas. This is the main body that's preventing a ceasefire from happening.

STEPHEN CENATIEMPO: But from our government's perspective, to sign that joint statement with 27 other countries effectively condemning Israel, is this driven by ignorance or is there some deeper ideological issue in the government at the moment?

DAVE SHARMA: Look, I think it's a deeper ideological issue in the government and I think it's, you know, domestic politics. I mean, the truth is that the statement that we sign is more intended for a domestic audience here in Australia than, you know, I don't think Hamas is listening. I don't think Israel's paying that much attention either. And I think, you know, throughout this conflict, the Australian government, the Labor government, has been very sort of grudging in accepting Israel's right to defend itself and right to recover hostages, and very quick to criticise any actions it takes in fulfilment of those objectives. Whereas Hamas has largely been given a free pass, like it's a force of nature, something with no moral agency. Well, no, Hamas is run by individuals who should be bound by a code of conduct and ethics and Morality like the rest of us.

STEPHEN CENATIEMPO: The biggest difficulty here is, though, for the local Jewish community, and I know you're very close to them because of your former role and, you know, and as a former member for Wentworth, I mean, your electorate was one of the largest Jewish populations in the country. I mean, there's a real sense of fear because, you know, let's for the sake of the argument, assume that The Israeli government's 100% wrong on everything. It doesn't have anything to do with individual Jews on the ground here.

DAVE SHARMA: No, absolutely right. People are, you know, saying that because people here are Jewish. You know, many, some of the Jewish Australian community arrived after the Second World War. Some have been here since the First Fleet. You know, we've had Jewish Australians since the very settlement of Australia. The idea that they should be held responsible for a state where some of them have links, some of them have no links, some of them might have citizenship, many of them would have no citizenship is just preposterous. And we don't allow that to happen to any other group of Australians. If we disagree with what the government of China is doing, we don't try and hold Chinese Australians accountable for that. If we disagree with what the government of Pakistan is doing or the government of Afghanistan, the Taliban, we don't go around and protest against Afghan Australians and say, this is your problem. But somehow we've allowed that situation to develop where Jewish Australians are being held collectively responsible for the actions of the state over which they have no control.

STEPHEN CENATIEMPO: So what do you make of the delays to implement the recommendations from Jillian Segal, the special envoy into anti Semitism? And the excuse being we need to wait from a report on Islamophobia? I mean, there's no mosque being firebombed that I've seen anywhere.

DAVE SHARMA: No, I don't think that's. I think that's right. I mean, I would take instances of Islamophobia as seriously as any other crime directed against any other minority community. But the truth is, it's the Jewish Australian community that has been made to feel unwelcome in their own country. They've been intimidated, harassed, had their businesses, you know, bullied, individuals doxxed, schools needing more security. This is the area that needs most attention right now if we're to, you know, remain a multi faith, multi ethnic, pluralistic nation.

STEPHEN CENATIEMPO: Extraordinary times, Dave. I appreciate your time this morning.

DAVE SHARMA: Thanks very much for having me, Stephen.

STEPHEN CENATIEMPO: All the best. Senator Dave Sharma is the Shadow Assistant Minister for Competition, Charities and Treasury and the former Ambassador to Israel.

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